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Ich habe genung

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1 Ich habe genung on Thu Aug 23, 2012 2:31 pm


Ich habe genung

“Ich habe genug” was the word I received from the Lord last night. If anyone would like to, please explore this with me because I do not fully understand the meaning yet..

Yesterday I was chatting with a friend and we were messing around in German. I cannot speak it well, but I can speak enough to recognize subjects and ask questions. During the discourse, he said to me “ich habe genug” which means, “I’ve had enough”. I didn’t know that so I asked for the interpretation. First time I have ever seen that.
So last night I went to bed around 11:00. I was laying there in bed and this music composer was talking about looking for just the right piece of music to match his star oboe player. The friend responded, “ich habe genug”, which is a beautiful piece by Bach. Needless to say, it required my fullest attention.

First performed on Feb 2, 1727, the piece was written as a job for the Catholic church to celebrate the purification of Mary. There are two prescribed readings for this feast… are you ready for this?

Malachi 3:1 and Luke 2:22

The first is the Lord coming to the temple and the second is the Lord Jesus being presented to Simeon.

Now, this is so powerful, I am almost speechless.

Mal 3:1
Behold, I send My messenger,
And he will prepare the way before Me.
And the Lord, whom you seek,
Will suddenly come to His temple,
Even the Messenger of the covenant,
In whom you delight.
Behold, He is coming,”
Says the LORD of hosts.

Luke 2:22
22 Now when the days of her purification according to the law of Moses were completed, they brought Him to Jerusalem to present Him to the Lord 23 (as it is written in the law of the Lord, “Every male who opens the womb shall be called holy to the LORD”),[f] 24 and to offer a sacrifice according to what is said in the law of the Lord, “A pair of turtledoves or two young pigeons.”[g]

….26 And it had been revealed to him by the Holy Spirit that he would not see death before he had seen the Lord’s Christ.

It is fairly easy to understand that Mary represents the church. I say to you that the days of her purifications are now coming to an end. The fiery trials are about to change. Do you think death will come before you see the Christ… hmmmm… better hold off on that for a moment.

The two turtle dove represent the two comings of the Christ. The dual work of the Lord is for the total cleansing of sin and its impact in our lives. When a person was to be cleansed of leprosy, they took two birds to the bird. The second bird was dipped in the blood of the first and then set free. The first bird was sacrificed.

Lev 14 Then the LORD spoke to Moses, saying, 2 “This shall be the law of the leper for the day of his cleansing: He shall be brought to the priest. 3 And the priest shall go out of the camp, and the priest shall examine him; and indeed, if the leprosy is healed in the leper, 4 then the priest shall command to take for him who is to be cleansed two living and clean birds, cedar wood, scarlet, and hyssop. 5 And the priest shall command that one of the birds be killed in an earthen vessel over running water. 6 As for the living bird, he shall take it, the cedar wood and the scarlet and the hyssop, and dip them and the living bird in the blood of the bird that was killed over the running water. 7 And he shall sprinkle it seven times on him who is to be cleansed from the leprosy, and shall pronounce him clean, and shall let the living bird loose in the open field.

Likewise the first coming was Christ’s crucifixion. The second one is His release to reign as King. Notice he comes dipped in blood.

Revelation 19:13
He was clothed with a robe dipped in blood, and His name is called The Word of God.
Now there is one other example I can think of. Jospeh’s coat of many colors, (a rainbow coat – meaning covenant) was dipped in blood.

Genesis 37:31
So they took Joseph’s tunic, killed a kid of the goats, and dipped the tunic in the blood

So what does Joseph have to do with the second coming? Oh that is simple. When Reuben the firstborn sinned against his father, the scepter (authority) and the birthright (right to rule) were split into two and given to Judah and Joseph. Messiah ben Judah comes in the first advent carrying a scepter. Remember, he was King of kings? He went away to receive a kingdom for Himself? Then when He returns, he comes for the birthright as Messiah ben Jospeh, establishing the Kingdom on Earth.

1 Chron 5 Now the sons of Reuben the firstborn of Israel—he was indeed the firstborn, but because he defiled his father’s bed, his birthright was given to the sons of Joseph, the son of Israel, so that the genealogy is not listed according to the birthright; 2 yet Judah prevailed over his brothers, and from him came a ruler, although the birthright was Joseph’s—

Folks, I think the Lord has had enough. When I prayed on what to pray, it was as if I was praying in the earth what He was saying in the heavens. “I’ve had enough.” The consolation of Israel (you) is at hand.

2 Re: Ich habe genung on Thu Aug 23, 2012 2:40 pm


So I am impressed to do a gematria search on 1727.. Here are three verses that have the value of 1727...

Exodus 1:9 And he said unto his people, Behold, the people of the children of Israel are more and mightier than we:

Num 16:48 And he stood between the dead and the living; and the plague was stayed.

Job 34:32 That which I see not teach thou me: if I have done iniquity, I will do no more.

3 Re: Ich habe genung on Fri Aug 24, 2012 3:01 am


When I read the title to this thread, I felt "I have enough" come forth. I haven't studied german for almost thirty years, but it was a distinct impression. As it turns out, 'ich habe genug can mean either, depending upon the context.

4 Re: Ich habe genung on Fri Aug 24, 2012 7:29 am


The words to the piece, so we can all see what they are. This is very interesting, especially the debatable interpretation of it, I'll post a link at the end if anyone desires to read up on it.

BWV 82 - "Ich habe genug"

Cantata for the Purification of Mary
1. Arie B
Ich habe genug,
Ich habe den Heiland, das Hoffen der Frommen,
Auf meine begierigen Arme genommen;
Ich habe genug!
Ich hab ihn erblickt,
Mein Glaube hat Jesum ans Herze gedrückt;
Nun wünsch ich, noch heute mit Freuden
Von hinnen zu scheiden. 1. Aria B
I have enough,
I have taken the Savior, the hope of the righteous,
into my eager arms;
I have enough!
I have beheld Him,
my faith has pressed Jesus to my heart;
now I wish, even today with joy
to depart from here.

2. Rezitativ B
Ich habe genug.
Mein Trost ist nur allein,
Daß Jesus mein und ich sein eigen möchte sein.
Im Glauben halt ich ihn,
Da seh ich auch mit Simeon
Die Freude jenes Lebens schon.
Laßt uns mit diesem Manne ziehn!
Ach! möchte mich von meines Leibes Ketten
Der Herr erretten;
Ach! wäre doch mein Abschied hier,
Mit Freuden sagt ich, Welt, zu dir:
Ich habe genug. 2. Recitative B
I have enough.
My comfort is this alone,
that Jesus might be mine and I His own.
In faith I hold Him,
there I see, along with Simeon,
already the joy of the other life.
Let us go with this man!
Ah! if only the Lord might rescue me
from the chains of my body;
Ah! were only my departure here,
with joy I would say, world, to you:
I have enough.
3. Arie B
Schlummert ein, ihr matten Augen,
Fallet sanft und selig zu!
Welt, ich bleibe nicht mehr hier,
Hab ich doch kein Teil an dir,
Das der Seele könnte taugen.
Hier muß ich das Elend bauen,
Aber dort, dort werd ich schauen
Süßen Friede, stille Ruh. 3. Aria B
Fall asleep, you weary eyes,
close softly and pleasantly!
World, I will not remain here any longer,
I own no part of you
that could matter to my soul.
Here I must build up misery,
but there, there I will see
sweet peace, quiet rest.

4. Rezitativ B
Mein Gott! wenn kömmt das schöne: Nun!
Da ich im Friede fahren werde
Und in dem Sande kühler Erde
Und dort bei dir im Schoße ruhn?
Der Abschied ist gemacht,
Welt, gute Nacht! 4. Recitative B
My God! When will the lovely 'now!' come,
when I will journey into peace
and into the cool soil of earth,
and there, near You, rest in Your lap?
My farewells are made,
world, good night!

5. Arie B
Ich freue mich auf meinen Tod,
Ach, hätt' er sich schon eingefunden.
Da entkomm ich aller Not,
Die mich noch auf der Welt gebunden. 5. Aria B
I delight in my death,
ah, if it were only present already!
Then I will emerge from all the suffering
that still binds me to the world.

©Pamela Dellal



5 Re: Ich habe genung on Fri Aug 24, 2012 10:10 am


You know after reading this again, what I see in this, is he is saying, "I have enough of Him, that I've had enough, of this World, to depart".



6 Re: Ich habe genung on Fri Aug 24, 2012 10:33 am


August 24th, 2012-08-24

So last night I gave a testimony about this at house church. When I got home at 10:50pm, the cantata was on the radio, AGAIN! Now, I know they repeat programs, but what is weird was it was playing like the 3rd movement and I recognized the underlying theme of Bach’s composition. I waited and the announcer confirmed it was the song!!!
So this verse in Malachi says again:

And the Lord, whom you seek,
Will suddenly come to His temple,

Keep this in mind until the punch line below.

Last night the house church leader played his favorite hymm for us by Francis Ridley Havergal (pronounced like Abigail). Here is a brief bio:

Frances Ridley Havergal (December 14, 1836 – June 3, 1879) was an English religious poet and hymn writer. Take My Life and Let it Be and Thy Life for Me (also known as I Gave My Life for Thee) are two of her best known hymns. She also wrote hymn melodies, religious tracts, and works for children.

She was born into an Anglican family, at Astley in Worcestershire. Her father, William Henry Havergal (1793–1870), was a clergyman, writer, composer, and hymnwriter. Her brother, Henry East Havergal, was a priest in the Church of England and an organist.
In 1852/3 she studied in the Louisenschule, Düsseldorf, and at Oberkassel. Otherwise she led a quiet life, not enjoying consistent good health; she travelled, in particular to Switzerland. She supported the Church Missionary Society.

She died of peritonitis at Caswell Bay on the Gower Peninsula in Wales at age 42. Her sisters saw much of her work published posthumously. Havergal College, a private girls' school in Toronto, is named after her. The composer Havergal Brian adopted the name as a tribute to the Havergal family.

Ok, so Havergal is a form of the name Abigail. I will look for some proof later. When I heard the name pronouced, instantly I remembered Dr. Jones’ blog.. Check this out…


Hebrew word studies #2, Abigail

Abigail means "my father redeems." It is spelled:

alef = ox, strength, first
beth = house, household
yood = hand; a deed; work
gimel = camel; pride (negative); to lift up (positive)
lamed = an ox goad; staff; authority

Abi means "my father." Gaal means "to redeem." Gaal is a gimel plus al, or el, which is the word for "God." In other words, gaal means "to lift up God." Hence, when Jesus said in John 12:32, "If I be lifted up from the earth, I will draw all men to Myself," it was a comment on this word gaal, "to lift up God."

This also shows that Jesus is God, as Isaiah 12:2, 3 affirms, saying, "God is my Yeshua."

Abigail has a numerical value of 46, which is the same as Levi (in Hebrew) and Adam (in Greek). The number 46 is the number of "temple" in Scripture, because the Greek word naos, "temple," appears 46 times in the New Testament. For this reason also, Jesus said in John 2:19, 20,

(19) . . . "Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up." (20) The Jews therefore said, "It took forty-six years to build this temple, and will You raise it up in three days?"

In fact, the phrase, "forty-six years to build this temple" carries a numerical value of 3588, which is 46 x 78. The odds of this phrase carrying a numerical value that is divisible by 46 is 46 to 1. If we factor in the fact that the phrase specifically mentions the temple and that "temple" occurs 46 times in the NT, the odds go through the roof.

So Abigail means "My father redeems." The divine truth in this is the fact that Jesus is our Redeemer, and that His blood has redeemed the entire estate that Adam lost when he sinned. God is building a temple out of His redeemed ones, the "living stones" of 1 Peter 2:5.

Is anyone still questioning that the Lord is coming to His temple?

7 Re: Ich habe genung on Fri Aug 24, 2012 10:58 am


Not me.

Don't you just love it when He does something like this, that is amazing Todd. It's like Nathan says, He doesn't hide things from us, as much as He hides things for us. We love a good mystery, but I tell ya, those mysteries are being revealed.

As He says, nothing hidden that won't be revealed.

The numbers thing is a little out of my comfort zone, but Wow, I'm so glad that there are those like you that find these things.
And that you share them with us. What I'm gleaning from this is, His coming/Appearing is going to be, no longer on an individually level, but Corporately, as He is doing in a small way here with us now.

Is this what your seeing too?


8 Re: Ich habe genung on Fri Aug 24, 2012 11:12 am


I don't know why, but storehouse, and storehouses comes to mind.


9 Re: Ich habe genung on Mon Aug 27, 2012 12:30 pm


Ok, wow. Storehouses….
That is very connected and I do not know how to explain it. You have to give me a little space here to hit a highlight.

When Israel rejected the yoke of wood, God gave them a yoke of iron. The yoke of wood is analogous to captivity while remaining in the land. A yoke of iron is analogous to captivity while being removed from the land. If you know the story, the people were removed into captivity because they rejected the judgment of God.

In our day, we too were sold into captivity. Like the Babylonian captivity of old, we were sold into powers that were similar in nature to the ones manifested in the original Babylonian city. This is the reason we have seen so much news come from Iran and Iraq which is a type and shadow for us. The ancient countries were Persia and Babylon. Persia overthrows in 539 B.C., and if anyone cares, I can show you how the same themes seem to be playing out today, including the Cyrus that obviously is coming onto the scene as we speak to take the city in rest (without a battle).

I was just cruzing around looking for more detail and the city has eight gates (new beginnings) and the most spectacular is the Ishtar (star) gate. Upon it is a Lion set in royal blue mosaic. Now, if that isn’t divine, I do not know what is. Father leaves His thumbprint wherever He goes.

So in our day, God did not want America rebelling against His judgment, so He gave us a yoke of wood and kept it a secret. If the church had known what had happened to them, they would have rebelled and the nation would have been swept away, but the church was given over to blindness as an act of grace. (In the law, if you blind a servant, you have to set them free. When God blinded America, it was a sign that He would eventually set the nation free.) The time of captivity is now coming to an end and the purposes are captivity are being fulfilled, all without the rebellious lot of church goers to convince the masses that God “loves them and would never punish them”. Ironically, it is now almost after the fact. The Babylonian captivity that we have lived through is passing and the secret is still never spoken about in contemporary Christian circles because most are completely ignorant. Therefore, it has remained a mystery or Mystery Babylon if you prefer.

Like all captivities, God keeps the wealth of the nation with the people. He doesn’t remove the wealth, He removes the access to the wealth. Some estimate today that there are 76 large caches of sovereign wealth hidden underground around the world. I think from what I have been told, there are more than that. This wealth will not be given to a rebellious people to do with whatever they want. It is, however, stored up for the purposes of the kingdom. Several years ago, the Lord began to speak to us of several ways that wealth would be transferred to His people for the purpose of the global ministry that would soon begin. I don’t think this is just a crazy notion. I think that we are seeing the signs that this is imminent.

When Solomon sinned and the wealth was removed from the nation (temple), it was moved to the commercial center and then later it went to Babylon with Nebuchadnezzar. There it was stored in very large underground vaults. We see a glimpse of this, because Belteshazzar sent for the golden goblets from which to drink from. The very night he did this, the handwriting on the wall appeared and he was killed. Mene Mene Tekel Parsin – exactly what is happening today. They got these temple articles from somewhere…….a storehouse.

If you go to natural Babylon today, you will see these large underground vaults. This is where the treasures of Israel were kept during the captivity (just like today). God took both the people and the treasure to Babylon and kept them together, even though they were separate and the treasure could not be accessed. When they came back to the Promised Land, they were given treasure from the storehouse to rebuild the natural city. Today, we will also be given from the storehouse to build the city (spiritual) Jerusalem (which is from above).

Ok, so where is this at? I am glad you asked. Heaven forbid I tell you a story without scripture to back it up.

Isa 45 “Thus says the Lord to His anointed,
To Cyrus, whose right hand I have held—
To subdue nations before him
And loose the armor of kings,
To open before him the double doors,
So that the gates will not be shut:
2 ‘I will go before you
And make the crooked places[a] straight;
I will break in pieces the gates of bronze
And cut the bars of iron.
3 I will give you the treasures of darkness
And hidden riches of secret places,
That you may know that I, the Lord,
Who call you by your name,
Am the God of Israel.

Who is it that overthrows Babylon? Cyrus, the Christ type. The words here “secret places” is actually vaults, hidden places, or stockpiles. Where did these stockpiles come from? Under Babylon. Cryrus found them when he took the city in 539 B.C.

Going down a little farther….

v13: I have raised him up in righteousness,
And I will direct all his ways;
He shall build My city
And let My exiles go free,
Not for price nor reward,”
Says the Lord of hosts

Now, does anyone want to guess what the treasures are for? For rebuilding the city, of course! Which city? The New Jerusalem. If you then know what Mystery Babylon is, then you know who the exiles are. Are you not looking for a country of your own?

I think the Lord is enough. I have enough. Ich habe gunnung. In Him there is no lack. We are supposed to be looking up at this point………..and His reward is with Him.

10 Re: Ich habe genung on Mon Aug 27, 2012 12:38 pm


If that wasn't enough... here are some excerpts from my friend Cheryl...

What I said was that when you see a “sign” of a white horse— whether literal, symbolic, linguistic, or otherwise, THEN the revalue of the Iraqi dinar will occur. Now to explain--but first a few other background connections.

Many people already understand that Iraq is the Babylon of old mentioned throughout Scripture. Some also recognize there is a “Mystery Babylon” spoken of that is described as ruling over all the nations of the earth. It is my belief that the moneychanger elites who rule the world ‘behind the curtain’ (the “mystery”), is the “Mystery Babylon” spoken of in Scripture (just ask who owns the Federal Reserve and you’ll see it is a great ‘mystery’).

“The borrower is slave to the lender” (Prov. 22:7), and we see no greater evidence than the monetary system we have today based on fiat currency and debt that can NEVER fully be paid off, since the interest on the debt (usury, which in the Scriptures is unlawful) must be paid by borrowing yet more dollars. It is the world’s biggest Ponzi scheme. Fiat currency (fiat means “faith”) is backed by nothing except the faith and confidence that the people have in it. The lenders of today are no different than the moneychangers of Jesus’ day, and scholars believe that Jesus came and cleaned house of this “den of robbers” not once, but twice.

The first time was toward the start of His ministry (John 2:15); the second was the final week just before His crucifixion (Mark 11:15), when the chief priests decided that it was time to get rid of Him (11:18).

On the first occasion (John 2:17), He quoted from Psalm 69:9,

(9) For the zeal [Heb. cana] of Thy house has consumed me, and the reproaches of those who reproach Thee have fallen on me.

On the second occasion (Mark 11:17), He quoted from Isaiah 56:7 and Jer. 7:11,

(Is. 56:7) . . . For My house will be called a house of prayer for all the peoples.
(Jer. 7:11) Has this house, which is called by My name, become a den of robbers in your sight?

It is interesting to me that Christchurch, New ZEALand suffered not one, but two earthquakes. You can ponder on that one.

I say all of this to show you the prophetic link between the moneychangers of Jesus’ day who attempted to control the world (as they knew it then), compared to the moneychangers of today who attempt the same, but on a broad, global scale. Large or small however, the spirit behind such works is the same. It is no different than the early attempts of Nimrod in building the tower of Babel in an attempt to reach “god-like” status. Those who are the puppet-masters pulling the strings on the world scene (be it war, politics, etc.) do so by virtue of control of the money. As the boastful Nathaniel Meyer Rothschild once said,

"Give me the control of the credit of a nation, and I care not who makes the laws."

So what is a person to do? We are in debt up to our ears, with no foreseeable way out, with the mystery elites in control. How is “Mystery Babylon” overthrown?

Let me first tell you how it is NOT overthrown.

It is not overthrown by joining a movement, be it Tea Party, Patriot, Tax Protest, or political action. These are the ways of man, and they will never work.

So how is it overthrown?

Let’s look to history for answers. After all,

What has been will be again,
what has been done will be done again;
there is nothing new under the sun. (Eccl. 1:9).

History tells us that literal Babylon was overthrown by Medo-Persia—an alliance between “Media” and “Persia”, under King Cyrus. Cyrus was God’s chosen vessel to overthrow Babylon, even being specifically named by God before he was even born! (See Isaiah 44 and 45).

Cyrus was known to be very generous and benevolent, in that not only was he instrumental in overthrowing Babylon, but also in freeing the captives (slaves) and allowing them to return to their Promise Land and rebuild the temple.

I believe that currently Prime Minister Maliki is a type of King Cyrus today. It's no secret that he is "Iran's" chosen guy and Iran is "Persia" of the Bible), and his religious identity is with Iran's predominant Shia sect. The surname Maliki comes from a varient "Melek" which means "KING". Maliki took the name Jawad in 1982 (LINK). Jawad means "a steed, open-handed, or generous". He was also known by the name of Abu Esraa. Abu means "Father"-- and Esraa is a variant of Ezra and means "helper" and "aid" (not to mention the fact that Ezra the prophet was a priest in the Old Testament who returned to Judah after exile in Babylon). Clearly then, his name seems to prophesy him as a type of the generous King Cyrus who 'frees the captives.'

In history, we know that King Cyrus overthrew Babylon and set the captives/slaves free. So prophetically we can suggest that Maliki will be instrumental in overthrowing “Mystery Babylon” and setting the captives/slaves free (from debt). Recall, again, that “a borrower is SLAVE to the lender.”

We should be able to look at history then, and get an idea of what and how this may occur. Most who know the story of the overthrow of Babylon, jump right to the part concerning their entry inside the walls of Babylon. But it really starts earlier than that--at least a year earlier, to be exact (hence it fits the type of Jesus' ZEAL against the moneychangers, twice).

Cyrus marched in the direction of Babylon and first came to the banks of an uncrossable river. Since the river could only be crossed by boat, Cyrus stopped at the river. Then out of the blue, one of his favorite white horses that went along on his march toward Babylon bolted off and tried to cross the river by itself. Galloping into the water, the horse was taken hold of by the current which swept him downstream and plunged him to his death. Cyrus became furious with rage and vowed to break the river’s strength, saying that future generations would be able to cross it without getting their knees wet . . . At this point, his plans to attack Babylon were now put on hold, and He divided his troops into two regiments. With the use of ropes he began to mark off areas on each side of this river, leading off from it in all directions, one hundred and eighty planned trenches on each side. He then commanded his forces to dig opposite one another on both banks. His threat to break the river soon became reality with the assistance of a great a number of workers. But it came at a cost, the whole summer season was now lost.

So you see, before Cyrus even got to Babylon, he first dealt with a very strong river that had swallowed up and drowned his beloved white horse. How does this apply today?

Consider that currency is the life-blood of a civilization, just as the currents that brought water are the life-blood of the city. The “liquidity” of the “current-cy” is what keeps the flow of commerce going. This river of liquidity, of ‘currents’, was directed on its path to Babylon by “banks” on either side.

Is that not true today? Surely! The banks on the east and the west (worldwide) are the mechanisms that control where the flow (currency) goes.

When Cyrus came with intent on overthrowing Babylon, he first came to this uncrossable river that he had to deal with first. He vowed to “break the river’s strength” after his white horse fled headlong into the dangerous currents. The result was that the mighty river was lowered by “diverting” its liquidity and strength through 180 channels dug on either side.

This, my friends, is the revalue of the Iraqi dinar.

Most all sites I have checked by googling state that there are “over 180 currencies” of the world. Yes, there are likely a little more or less, but the irrefutable fact is that they use the term “180 currencies” consistently.

So what you have here is a “breaking of the strength” of this river done by diverting “currents” from both sides of the river, east and west (i.e., worldwide), “through the banks.” The RV will affect every currency of the world (which the 180 diversion trenches typify), and every bank of the world.

“Cyrus” (Maliki) is the man that accomplishes this, but history tells us that it will not occur until the “white horse” sign—a sign of its ‘death’ or ‘end’ comes first. It (the RV) could NEVER have occurred however, until SPRING (as that is when Cyrus’ journey began). Spring just began on March 21 and runs through June 21, so I would expect this sign to occur in that window. It also took them all summer to complete the trenches, breaking the strength of the river. I would expect, then, that it will take all summer to get the bugs ironed out as the new things associated with the RV get up and running.

The thing we need to be looking for then is a “white horse sign”—and a sign of its ‘death’ or ‘end.’

So what could that be?

Here’s a few thoughts I will toss out there.

Buraq is the muslim name of the white horse that their prophet Mohammed rode.

Barak is a variant similar to Buraq (Barak Obama’s acceptance speech was at Mile High Stadium, home of the “broncos,” and adorned with a “white horse” atop its stadium.

Pegasus is the “white horse” constellation in the night sky.

Then of course, there is the “white horse” riders mentioned in the book of Revelation:

I watched as the Lamb opened the first of the seven seals. Then I heard one of the four living creatures say in a voice like thunder, "Come!" 2 I looked, and there before me was a white horse! Its rider held a bow, and he was given a crown, and he rode out as a conqueror bent on conquest. (Rev. 6:1-2).

And I saw heaven opened, and behold, a white horse, and He who sat on it is called Faithful and True, and in righteousness He judges and wages war. (Rev. 19:11).

In my studied opinion (and there are many out there on just this small topic), these are two different riders of white horses in Revelation. What tells me the difference is the fact that one is “faithful and true” (Jesus/Overcomers), and the other believes he is a conqueror and rides out bent on conquest--- yet has no “ammunition” (arrows).

I believe the white horse of Rev. 6:2 is a type of the very same white horse of Cyrus’ that broke free with purposeful intent to conquer the strength of the river—and yet perished. It perished because it was ill-equipped (even as the white horse rider in Rev. 6:2 is). It believes by sheer might and determination that it can prevail, but it will not (as the story of Cyrus shows us).

Since we know that the white horse rider of Rev. 19:11 is “faithful and true,” it is logical then to say the white horse rider of Rev. 6:2 is the counterfeit, the diametric opposite of that. It is not “faithful” and not “true”—though it may LOOK just like it.

So who or what might this counterfeit white horse be?

Two days ago I was watching Glenn Beck’s show concerning an audio tape smuggled out of a secret meeting led by Stephen Lerner of SEIU, and their economic terroristic plan to bring about the “fall of Wall Street” and the government...i.e., “Mystery Babylon.” This plan is supposed to be implemented more broadly here in the U.S. in the month of May; however, they have already organized similar plans in the UK—beginning this weekend. The interesting part is that at 1:13 into the March 23 episode, Glenn shows a flyer about the scheduled protest “Occupy London” (beginning March 26, today), and on the cover is a “white horse.” Glenn said the white horse represents “the people’s power” and their attempt to take back control over the government and the money stolen from them by ‘the Wall Streeters and big banks’, by bringing down the very stability of the government and Wall Street itself.

If this “people’s power” is the “white horse” type, it surely seems to fit Rev. 6:1. No matter how much “organized power” the people have, they will never prevail in overcoming the strength of this river alone. I would caution everyone who even thinks about getting involved in any attempt at a “people’s revolution” against the banks, to think twice. You will not win this. They are too powerful.

Nevertheless, many will buy into it. This “people’s revolution” will be put down though… it will drown even as Cyrus’ white horse drowned, and it will drown for the same reason: impetuousness and carelessness, and not being equipped to navigate safely.

WHEN this happens, THEN you will see “Cyrus” (God’s appointed man of the hour- Maliki), bring about the revalue of the dinar, and prophetically digging the trenches diverting the currents into the pockets of Mom and Pops around the world.

History shows that it was one year later that Cyrus went again toward Babylon, this time easily crossing/navigating the first river. Therefore I would not expect the complete downfall of “Mystery Babylon” (the moneychangers/elite banksters of the world) until one year after the RV, in the spring of the year. That discussion though, will be for a separate discussion at another time.

11 And One More on the White Horse on Mon Aug 27, 2012 12:45 pm


You can't make this stuff up....More from Cheryl.. you can get the date from the context...

Perhaps this is stretching it a bit, and I fully, FULLY admit that as a distinct possibility... BUT...

Osama's given name was actually Osama Bin Mohammed (Osama son of Mohammed). See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osama_bin_laden He had shortened it to refer to his great grandfather' name, Laden).

Osama in Japanese means KING. Bin means "son of". Laden means "loaded down, freighted, or burdened" (See: http://thinkexist.co.../meaning/laden/).

There is also the possibility that this white horse sign related to "King" Cyrus would also be related to the white horse of Rev. 6:2 that is "crowned" and goes forth conquering and to conquer. Only a "King" is crowned. And there is no question that Cyrus' white horse went forth trying to 'conquer' the strength of the river. The fact that the white horse of Rev. 6:2 has no arrows speak to its actual weakness, though it believes itself strong.

The muslim religion holds to an interesting story about Mohammed and a white horse....A white horse named BURAQ. See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buraq According to their writings, Buraq is the white horse who carried ("laden with") Mohammed to the Temple Mount in Jerusalem, and then to the seventh heaven for 'divine instruction', and finally took him back to Mecca.

Of course we also have a "Barak" (an alternative spelling of Buraq) that announced the world is no longer "burdened" (laden with) with this terrorist, and apparently is the one who authorized a burial at sea.

These are interesting coincidences that I thought about yesterday, but only when they announced he had a BURIAL AT SEA did it click as a distinct possibility that the death of Osama Bin Laden could very well be a type of the death of the white horse that is the precursor sign of the imminent RV. Remember that when Cyrus came to do battle with Babylon (in our day, this is the "mystery moneychangers" of the world-- Mystery Babylon type), he came to river that was uncrossable and his white horse bolted headlong into the river and died. Cyrus THEN "diverted the currents" with 180 trenches on either side of the "banks" (there are 180 currencies, generally speaking, that are diverted globally by these central "banks").

Is Osama's burial at sea a type of the white horse's death/drowning in the river?

What I found interesting was this article where Osama is quoted as comparing the United States and al-Qaida to racing horses, as this excerpt reflects:
"When people see a strong horse and a weak horse," he told his acolytes over table talk, "by nature, they will like the strong horse."

In his cracked vision, America was the weak nag, and al-Qaida the strong destrier.

But the last 10 years have taught us differently: In life as well as death, Osama bin Laden was always the weak horse.

See: http://seattletimes...._douthat03.html

Moreover, it is just as interesting that he had been an avid horse racer and arabian (white) horse breeder. See: http://www.guardian....qaida.terrorism

12 Re: Ich habe genung on Mon Aug 27, 2012 12:47 pm


Summer ends Sept 22nd.. I strongly urge you all to watch the money events between now and then...

13 Re: Ich habe genung on Mon Aug 27, 2012 1:59 pm


Today while you were writing, I was invited to participate in a conference call with Brad from BH Group (its members control several trillion dinar) and a couple of bankers and there does seem to be some momentum on this subject. There is a global currency reset in the wind and the euro crisis and the dollar soon to be crisis appear about to erupt into a significant earthquake. Isaac is churning up the gulf and broke up the planned start of the Republican convention and as Abraham's promised son, is carrying plenty of rain. I was just thinking about Isaac re-digging his father's wells and the first two were stolen but the third demonstrated that God was with him and his enemies withdrew. There are many who have approached the dinar as a personal windfall and for them it will be like winning the lottery and blowing it all. For others, however, they will understand that God has purposed to provide the capacity to build a city whose maker and builder is God. This Jerusalem is a spiritual city and even this forum is a day of small beginnings as we begin to be placed stone to stone in alignment with the corner. As we realize that giving multiplies the blessing and keep our hearts focused on Him with whom we have to deal, I believe that we will become that army following our rider on the white horse. The first horse may have perished but this horse shall prevail. Even Disney saw the truth in The Lion King.

14 Re: Ich habe genung on Mon Aug 27, 2012 1:59 pm


Enough is just about enough!!!

15 Re: Ich habe genung on Mon Aug 27, 2012 2:39 pm


Not to diminish everything that's been said here . . .because it "is" exciting and intriguing, but at the same time, I'm a bit of a skeptic when it comes to applying Scripture to current events, mainly because everyone else I've run into that has done the same thing has only created more questions than they did bringing answers.

I'm not about to thwart this conversation though, by all means, continue sharing, perhaps I'll see the light as well. I do know one thing . . . Scherryl was talking about weakening the river with the 180 man-made ditches . . .two things did come to mind. One is, this river that descended in so much power . .what happens when you do a "180"? Do you not become the opposite of what you once were? When someone "does a 180" on something, it means they did a direct turn-around. So that would also fit with this powerful river being affected by the devises of men, it completely loses it's power.

The second thing . . .and all through reading all of this, "this" is the passage that jumped out at me the most. It's also in Revelation where it's speaking about the Euphrates river drying up. The word "Euphrates" literally means "fruitfulness". And the reason it's drying up is to PREPARE for the KINGS OF THE EAST . ..

This is where I kinda divert off the natural application and cling to the spiritual in that WE are kings and priests . . .and our identity is not of the natural realm of things to come, as everything in this realm is but a vapor, but of the spiritual manifestation birthing within us. Our identity is in the RISING OF THE SUN . . .in other words, our message is one of resurrection.

16 Re: Ich habe genung on Mon Aug 27, 2012 3:02 pm


Wow, Nathan come on in, the water's fine.. (sorry for the terrible pun)

Here's the thing, scripture has to apply to current events at some point. Not so much nautral for natural, but honestly it is His-story.

Now, I totally fell for many of the ideas that people espouse concerning prophetic fulfillment. Many of those things since have proven to be quite false. Looking back, there are a couple of lessons.

1) I did not receive a confirmation from the Lord on those things.
2) They did not increase the revelation of Jesus Christ in the earth.
3) They left me afraid sometimes.
4) They usually wanted my money.


What I see happening now with the types of parallels above is that they not only follow the original historical pattern which does not change, but they also encourage me greatly that what we have been waiting for is nearly upon us. There are of course, many levels to this concept.

The Kings of the East are also the eastern nations, although I agree we are also kings and priests. Again symbolism, but we see today the eastern nations preparing to bring down the Babylonian system, through the symbols . All out lives, we almost were taught to live in fear of those nations, but today we see God using them to devliver us of this godless government, whether they know God or not.

Surely, as we have seen the fruitfulness drain away from the nation, we have seen the approaching collapse of Babylon. Just like the biblical account. In the same way we have spiritual Kings God is preparing, just like the eastern kings are preparing the overthrow of the financial system. All those who have lusted for God's throne will be sorely disappointed.

17 Re: Ich habe genung on Mon Aug 27, 2012 4:10 pm


I agree that it is a fine line between having understanding of the times and a wicked generation seeking after a sign...a line that we all sometimes trip over. As things change in the spirit, there is a corresponding change in the earth. Knowing which is which and not getting caught up with circumstances around us is the challenge of life. Good reminder, thanks.

18 Re: Ich habe genung on Mon Aug 27, 2012 4:19 pm


I have really fallen into that trap.. Just getting overwhelmed with news... It is then I have to go back and let the spirit just bring the things to my attention that matter. Everything else has to fall to the side...If you are striving, you are failing I think,..

19 Re: Ich habe genung on Mon Aug 27, 2012 7:28 pm


Yeah, I'm still not sure on all of it. Wasn't the book of Revelation depicting the relationship between Israel and Christ? I guess I've not seen the indication that it's between Christ and the entire world as a whole. In Matthew 24 when they asked about when these things will happen, that whole context was the same language as what Daniel used and what John used . . .and even Jesus reached back and brought Daniel's dream up to "his" days on the earth. That which Daniel was told to seal, Jesus reopened. That which John saw being opened he was instructed to leave it opened because it had already begun. Now, Todd, I'm sure you've heard this before, but the time between Daniel and Jesus was what . . .600 years or so? So because it wasn't going to happen for 600 years, Daniel was specifically told to close it, and he was also told that it wasn't for his time.

Then Jesus comes along, the same Lamb that John saw in his vision, and for me, in Matthew 24:15 . . .Jesus is speaking here . . .

When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)

"That" was the breaking of the first of seven seals. What Daniel saw was the events that unfolded in A.D. 70. And what John saw and wrote was the same thing, thats why John was told to leave the book opened. Now, IF those prophecies in Revelation were for a generation 2000 years removed . . . . wouldn't there have been some indication for that? It was for Daniel and that went for only 600 years. yet it's been more than 2000 since the unveiling of the nature of Christ ...

I hadn't heard of what you said before when you talked about . . .I'm not even sure how you put it. But one was when Israel was bound "in" Israel and the other was when they were in bondage and removed from Israel. Sacrificing wood and iron? Never heard of the connection, but you've brought MUCH in my life that I'd never heard before. But it's just that I can see how that same pattern would fit the events leading up to the destruction not only of Israel as a nation, but the destruction of the entire relgious system.

Oh, and we've never discussed this, but I for one don't beleive there's ever going to be a new temple erected in Israel where animal sacrifices start up again. I know just about every Christian Jew thinks there is, but at the same time, just about every evangelical Christian believes there's eternal tormnet as well. My reason for believing this is based on the fact that they didn't choose to stop, God stepped in and shut the door on it. For them to start animal sacrifices up again would mean that everything Jesus did was for naught. But that's probably for another thread.

What I see the prophecies in Revelation to be about is the ultimate destruction of the religious system due to their rejection of Jesus being the ultimate sacrifice for all mankind. it was literally affecting those to whom it was literally written to in that day.

Remember when Jesus ascended up into the clouds and the angels posed the question . . ."why are you standing here gazing up in the clouds? Just as you saw him go he'll return. Do you suppose that's possibly a spiritual picture as well? That maybe people strainging to see beyond what can be seen that . . .well . . .had they remained there, they would have missed the outpouring in the ascended place that awaited them. Now "there's" an irony . . .they could have completely missed the greatest release of the power of the Spirit known to man had they remained fixed on trying to comprehend the invisible things of God . . . So I guess for me, it's not about knowing everything ahead of time, it's about being in the ascended place when it's all released.

I'm rambling I think. But this again is why I like this kind of banter. I feel the security to ask questions and see differnt things without warring about it. But don't get me wrong . . .I'm open to what you guys are bringing to the table. This appears complicated to me but at the same time, I'm not about to denounce any of it. Not on purpose anyway. I want it all! I what what I can see and I want what I can't. I am convinced God is in all of you so when you share, I know it's God speaking in you whether "I" get it or not. It's not about "me" . . .right?

20 Re: Ich habe genung on Mon Aug 27, 2012 11:35 pm


There are so many levels to be understood and you can easily get lost in the details. Jeremiah prophesied to the southern kingdom because they refused to submit to their captors and ultimately were removed from their own land and taken to Babylon...and from there into the north. (They were placed under an iron yoke rather than being able to stay and serve their captors through taxation in their own land...a wooden yoke). The traditions of the church have so misunderstood the spiritual truth that the name of Israel was not given to Judah but rather to Ephraim...the leading tribe of the northern kingdom...recall as Jacob (then Israel) prayed prophetically over Joseph's sons and Joseph wanted to put the right hand on the firstborn and Israel prayed over the younger. The names are significant as well as the prophecies given but it is significant to realize that Judah does not have the birthright or the prophetic heritage to use the name of Israel.

This is actually a reversal of the conniving of Jacob who stole Esau's birthright. Esau became Edom and Judah went into the north and compelled the Edomites to convert to Judaism. Now, for a season, Judah has claimed that they are the chosen of God (Israel) when in fact that is not so. Old Jerusalem is not the important place that religion and tradition have made it out to be. Those that are excited about the red heifer sacrifice and are enraged that the Dome of the Rock would sit on the temple mount and anticipate the day that the temple is rebuilt so that the antichrist can be enthroned, so that Jesus can return; are not able to see or understand spiritual things or the New Jerusalem coming down out of the realm of the spirit.

As for the revelation, let me go back to English 101. The professor taught that every good essay or book should have an introduction, body and conclusion. As I look at the Bible, I see the book of beginnings (Genesis) as an introduction that catches my attention and gives hints to the entire book. We see the seventh day when God sits and says It is very good, and the covenant of grace given to Abraham. The middle books give the character development and progress of our hero through the scarlet thread. Revelation sums up what has been going on from the beginning in an apocalyptic, prophetic, poetic picture concluding with Jesus as the spirit of prophecy. Beginning in God and concluding in God, we see woes and judgments and who have lost their heads. We receive precious promises about overcoming and receiving a new name and a white stone, and a new heart, and crowns that we can present to our Lord.

Once we understand that there are only two men in all of history....Adam and Christ, and that all of the battles are between flesh and spirit...the first Adam and the second Adam, then we can begin to appreciate the process and the progression back into God from whence Adam fell. Jesus came to His own and they received Him not....in fact they crucified Him. The parables show us that His own wanted the master of the vineyard dead so they could have it for themselves. That is the nature of fallen man and that is why it is our sin that nailed Him to the tree. As the veil of confusion (mystery Babylon) is torn from our eyes, we can begin to understand that all of the exercise of burning sacrifices was to teach the reality that the consequence (wages if you will) of sin is death. Love says while you are dead in your trespass and sin and my enemy, I will love you so much that I will lay down my life for you. That is the purpose of this age...that we might learn the love of God....and how ugly things become when we are separated from Him and His love.

21 Re: Ich habe genung on Mon Aug 27, 2012 11:53 pm


What can you add to that. That was Beautifully put Mark.



22 Re: Ich habe genung on Tue Aug 28, 2012 12:53 pm


Will the real Israel please stand up?

Nathan, your book on Revelation was truly a progressive work. I have it around here somewhere and need to go back and look at it again. It would be interesting to see if I feel about the same way as I did when I looked at it the first time.

Let me state for the record that I no longer view Israel as a group of historical people that live in the Middle East. The study is fascinating.

When the nation came together under David, it was comprised as 10 tribes in the north and two in the south. Interestingly, the same pattern is seen in Leah and Rachel. There were ten tribes under the law (“according to our custom”) and two that were of the chosen bride (Benjamin and Joseph). Leah had weak eyes and could not see, which says to me that she was in a sense, blind.

When the ewe lamb (Rachel) started having children, it is interesting that neither Leah or the two concubines had any more. This is also a type of what is to come. When the true bride begins/began to have spiritual children, there is no longer a place for the children of the law. Read into that what you will.

Joseph was of the northern tribes, while Benjamin was gathered with Judah in the south. The word “Jew” is a shortened version of the name Judah. We know according to 1 Chron 5, that Judah was given the scepter, while Joseph was given the birthright (right to rule). Judah returned from Babylonian captivity to fulfill the prophecies concerning the Messiah, even though the bible says her sins were worse. The scripture would have to be fulfilled regardless, thus the Christ would be born in Bethlehem, raised in Nazareth, and so forth. God would have to bring a remnant back into the land to fulfill the scripture. Interestingly, when that time was done, the nation was destroyed.

The ten northern tribes were never brought back into the land. The rabbi’s knew that being from the tribes of Judah and Benjamin, they were NOT inheritors of the birth right. Also interesting, the leaders were money hungry, extorting the people in the very house of God. The very same patterns exist today in both the natural and the spiritual.

The tribes and Benjamin and Judah neglected to “rescue” the others from the captivity in Assyria. My guess is that it was intentional. They may have believed that if Joseph was lost, that the right to rule would fall to them since they were the only ones in the land.

Isaiah and other places in the text talk about the lost tribes of Israel. They were scattered among the nations of the world. I believe that this is yet another move of the Spirit that fulfills the mandate to go out to the entire world. God will always have His way, regardless of our cooperation.

We know that Israel stay in the Caucus mountain region, and later immigrated to Europe. The royal families in Europe were descendants of the Israeli nation. From there, they immigrated to North and South America. This is why we see the ancestry of Israel in almost every nation on earth today. Within that bloodline, there is a the lost tribe of Joseph, who possesses the right to rule. I think God did it this way to make eligible all people… for as many as believed; He gave them the right to become the sons of God.

Natural Israel is not Israel at all. It is Judah. The people there are primarily descendents of the natural tribes of Benjamin and Judah, and later Edom. When deciding a name, the usurped the name Israel, I believe also intentionally. The reason was because of the birthright. If they were in fact Judah, they would have no legal right to rule. Therefore, the nation took the name of Israel because of the birthright issue. Now, if you understood the money system, then you would also understand that most of the banking cartel is led through ties back to the same money changing power that we saw in the temple. It is the same exact, rule the world, love of mammon spirit in operation.

So who is the Israel? Where are they?

Rom 2:28 For he is not a Jew who is one outwardly, nor is circumcision that which is outward in the flesh; 29 but he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the Spirit, not in the letter; whose praise is not from men but from God.

And now you know. And yes, it does mean that it is a spiritual qualification now.

When we understand this, we understand why in places in the bible the nation of Israel is restored and in other places it is destroyed forever.

More on this later.

23 Re: Ich habe genung on Tue Aug 28, 2012 1:44 pm


Todd...I believe that I hear the rumblings of a major earthquake.

I've had enough...there were two times that we see the anger and wrath of God that were demonstrated through Jesus and both times it involved the money changers. It would be a simple matter to spend days on the Rothschilds and the Illuminati and all of the other cabals that are in control of the debt system that holds the world in bondage. God is again knitting his whip and preparing to clean house and when He does, there are many who will be shocked at what unfolds. Tradition has deprived us for so many years of truth and today deception has become so ingrained that truth lies fallen in the street of Jerusalem. Netanyahu and the Mossad seldom let truth interfere with their plans. They simply use false flag events and allegations to change the truth into a lie and manipulate the people into conflict that maintains their control. The very people that God had blessed with His presence and victories became the very ones that crucified the Son.

As we begin to understand the sovereignty of God and how His ways are usually inversions of the ways of the natural mind, we can gain more and more understanding of who's on first and which end is up. As science came to understand that the cornea and lens of our eye actually sees things upside down and our mind turns them right side up, we are having our minds enlightened to the point that our heavens roll back as a scroll and a new heaven emerges and we see how upside down things really are.

The leaders of Goldman, Sachs among others at the top of the financial heap (with all of their homes in the Hamptons and the islands of the world) are soon to confront the reality of an angry God. When they do, the Israel that can bulldoze a Rachel Corrie with impunity for standing in front of a bulldozer destroying Palestinian homes in the Gaza, and then throw out the lawsuit for damages for the death of a beautiful 23 year old armed with a bullhorn (trumpet) and call it a warzone casualty; shall discover that vengeance truly is the Lord's and He will repay. As these things change...and change they will...many who have misplaced their loyalty through measuring outwardly instead of trying the spirit by the spirit will be dismayed. They have looked to escape via rapture never understanding that being caught up in the spirit they are changed into an army with banners.

Truth will prevail over deception and it is time for truth to arise in the hearts and mouths of Gideon's band.

24 Re: Ich habe genung on Tue Aug 28, 2012 2:19 pm


On top of all this, Mark, I am seeing one other issue that REALLY seems to impart a certain sense of urgency to this upcoming "change in management." Authority has long been granted to the world's courts to punish men for committing crimes. The heavenly court has, of course, retained jurisdiction over crimes that a man is merely thinking about committing. After all, only God Himself knows what is in a man's heart. Haven't you seen how TPT^3B have in recent years gone after that jurisdiction? Men are being arrested and held for what the earthly principalities and powers believe they WILL DO, rather than for what they HAVE DONE. Certainly they must realize that they are usurping the authority of the heavenly court when they punish a man for what they believe is in his heart.

25 Re: Ich habe genung on Wed Aug 29, 2012 10:59 am


So, this is really insightful.

Regardless of how we feel about the struggle or the evil in the world, the bible was clear that these times would come. What capacity they would come in, is not clear. I would expect tribulation to be both on a personal level and a corporate one, with the caveat that in Christ, the enemies are silenced. Revelation is all about overcoming the struggle and overcoming the enemies of our soul. Of course, there is going to be a battle, but the spiritual one is much more serious than the natural one.

David, that was a particularly insightful comment you posted about the court. The man of lawlessness is a corporate man, in contradiction to what we have been told. The church world looks for a devil in a suit, taking the highest position, possibly somewhere in the Middle East, and legislating the world from there. The problem is that we have largely missed the “man” which is all around us. Do you think that God would really rise up a single person to fill the man of lawlessness role? I do not expect it to happen on that level.

There are embodiments of this man, and I can think of a few… quite a few actually. It is when we see people acting contrary to Christ. Sin is lawlessness, because the Law was a testimony of Christ. Everything the law states, is true concerning the Christ. Anything contradicting the Law, God’s Law that is, is a contradiction to the nature and character of Christ our Lord. This has been going on since the beginning of course, but most of the time it has been hidden in darkness. The problem centers around man wanting to make the laws, rather than submitting to God’s law.

Now in our day, every deed that is hidden shall be made known. The darkness in our lives is very real and we all struggle. It is most likely being made known in some capacity, because we are not exempt. Are we not admonished to confess our sins one to another? We are, and in so doing, we take the sting out of our failures by making them known before God forces the issue.

But to the man of lawlessness, he keeps his deeds hidden, in darkness if you will. That is why the most heinous, egregious violations are merely starting to come to the surface and are now coming forth according to the scripture. I do not suggest that we focus on such things, but we should be aware the word brought all this to our attention and we should be wise as serpents concerning the time in which we are living. Awake, alert, aware, and decisive about our defenses against such things. God did make provision for us.

This man of lawlessness is now seeking for even more control. He is Adam in the truest since of the name. He is human, a hewn-down man…. HUMAN. In the garden, he thought he would ascend, by the knowledge of good and evil. In Isaiah 14 and Ezekial 28…

For you have said in your heart:
‘I will ascend into heaven,
I will exalt my throne above the stars of God;
I will also sit on the mount of the congregation
On the farthest sides of the north;
14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds,
I will be like the Most High.’

Now, surely someone will say this is the devil. I will contend that it is Adam and can prove it without a doubt. It was Adam that thought by eating the fruit of knowledge of good and evil that he could be like God.

Well the unredeemed mind, opposite the mind of Christ, is very much the same mindset that Adam had after the fall. It wants to control and manipulate. It sees the works of God as a threat to itself, and indeed they are. God condemned sin in the flesh of course. It wants the position that God Himself has. Do you think it strange that Adam wants to judge the thoughts and conditions of the heart, as is reserved for Christ the judge only? No it is not strange, thus we have hate crimes. You can be convicted and sent up the river for intent, never having done a crime against a person or property. Politicians contend for position to write the next law, to be in control, and to tell everyone else what is right and what is wrong. It is as if God is saying to us, “Someday you will learn my ways were much easier and better.”

I really like what you wrote David.

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